But male athletes that play popular sports are always given exceptional treatment. That, and the fact that if indeed the Lakers "fired" Kobe, the rest of the league would try to hire him in less than a nanosecond.
Such is the amoral world of sports.
Are you serious? If you are a performer you can get by with a lot in any industry. Such is the world of making MONEY.
-- Edited by Abyss on Tuesday 10th of May 2011 10:16:00 PM
In many high-profile industries, public homophobia would result in a sharp decrease in one's money-making power. Athletics is one such area where there is no such correlation.
But male athletes that play popular sports are always given exceptional treatment. That, and the fact that if indeed the Lakers "fired" Kobe, the rest of the league would try to hire him in less than a nanosecond.
Such is the amoral world of sports.
Are you serious? If you are a performer you can get by with a lot in any industry. Such is the world of making MONEY.
-- Edited by Abyss on Tuesday 10th of May 2011 10:16:00 PM
In many high-profile industries, public homophobia would result in a sharp decrease in one's money-making power. Athletics is one such area where there is no such correlation.
I suppose I probably wouldn't have laughed so hard if I'd heard about the crime. I didn't know what situation it had referred to. how awful (and no, I still don't want to hear details, so we can pass over that one). What a lowlife she is, who cares about traumatizing your clients further if you can get a little more publicity.
This incident was traumatic for those girls when they were at the ballfield, hence the lawsuit. It seems like the graphic explanation and visual aid, while seated next to Ms. Allred is far, far worse.
Oh my God. That was ridiculously hysterical. Good thing we have Gloria Alred around to demonstrate such things. Her existence itself is offensive! I'd like to say that was the low point of my day, but it's been kind of a bad day, so perhaps that was the high point (because it feels great to laugh).
A wealthy liberal lawyer demonstrates how it's done, for those that can't figure it out on their own, on national TV while trying to get even wealthier:
But male athletes that play popular sports are always given exceptional treatment. That, and the fact that if indeed the Lakers "fired" Kobe, the rest of the league would try to hire him in less than a nanosecond.
Such is the amoral world of sports.
Are you serious? If you are a performer you can get by with a lot in any industry. Such is the world of making MONEY.
-- Edited by Abyss on Tuesday 10th of May 2011 10:16:00 PM
"One group knows well that it's relatively 100% immune from a certain type of discrimination. Yet it has the right to tell groups that are most likely to be the victims of that discrimination to get over it, most of the time without much substantive argument?
Laughable."
You are generalizing way too much. This group, that group, someone has the right to be angry if they are this group, if not, you have no right. Ask any successful person who is in a minority group, is it helpful in your life to keep that giant chip on your shoulder, or should you just let it go? I have a philosophy in life that works pretty well. You can always choose to be offended, or choose not to be offended. I always choose NOT, even if it is intended. Works pretty darn well.
Gee, should all women be angry if he had called the ref a girl, a pussy or a ho? Were you as offended when he cheated on his wife and very probably raped a hotel clerk? Now those are some things that rank pretty highly on the scumbag list. As Bogney said:
"If Kobe can survive raping / rough consentual sex with a young woman in Colorado, then he will be unscathed by this. Hey, it probably gives him street cred to sell more shoes."
"Self-serving perspective? Not sure what you mean. I went back to re-read my post from days ago, and still don't see how it's a self-serving perspective, or one that condones slurs. Your response is puzzling."
Well, insults to you aren't relevant. You're white? Well, you're of the favored group, so it doesn't matter what anyone says to you, you can't really understand the pain of being in a minority group. It doesn't matter if you've been mocked for some physical charachteristic, or the way you talk, what you wear, or if you've been bullied. If you aren't gay or in some other racial group, you can't understand! It is just ridiculous of you to even empathize with others or compare your own experiences. You can't understand, you're probably just in your little racist homophobe world, and to have any sort of opinion about any sort of homophobic or racist slight is not allowed!!
Sigh. Really, nba, you can do better than that. Argue the point, not that someone has a "self serving perspective" because they dare to comment when they aren't the right color or sexuality to be entitled to have an opinion.
There was a segment on The Colbert Report a few years ago where there was a videotape of some US politician with some German-sounding last name basically telling Muslim-Americans to get over being unfairly profiled because all Americans had a duty to sacrifice their rights for greater public safety.
Colbert rightfully ripped that politician for pretending as if we lived in a world where someone named "Lichtman" would be the victim of profiling as someone named "Jarudi".
One group knows well that it's relatively 100% immune from a certain type of discrimination. Yet it has the right to tell groups that are most likely to be the victims of that discrimination to get over it, most of the time without much substantive argument?
"Self-serving perspective? Not sure what you mean. I went back to re-read my post from days ago, and still don't see how it's a self-serving perspective, or one that condones slurs. Your response is puzzling."
Well, insults to you aren't relevant. You're white? Well, you're of the favored group, so it doesn't matter what anyone says to you, you can't really understand the pain of being in a minority group. It doesn't matter if you've been mocked for some physical charachteristic, or the way you talk, what you wear, or if you've been bullied. If you aren't gay or in some other racial group, you can't understand! It is just ridiculous of you to even empathize with others or compare your own experiences. You can't understand, you're probably just in your little racist homophobe world, and to have any sort of opinion about any sort of homophobic or racist slight is not allowed!!
Sigh. Really, nba, you can do better than that. Argue the point, not that someone has a "self serving perspective" because they dare to comment when they aren't the right color or sexuality to be entitled to have an opinion.
Having been a woman, and been called several derogatory names before by more than one person in my life beginning in middle school, yes, I agree it's painful and ugly and not fun. Did I say degrading? Yes. That too.
Self-serving perspective? Not sure what you mean. I went back to re-read my post from days ago, and still don't see how it's a self-serving perspective, or one that condones slurs. Your response is puzzling.
But certainly your choice to say it, as always.
-- Edited by SamuraiLandshark on Saturday 30th of April 2011 09:46:48 PM
I remember the old expression my parents taught me when I was a kid:
"Sticks and stones will break my bones, but words will never hurt me."
I don't see uttering those words on the court as a fireable offense, no matter whether to the coach or the refs. It's trash talk that propels these testerone-fueled games. I don't condone it, and yet, how do you stop it? It's a game, which is a little like a mock war, if you come down to it.
I do think a simple fine would be enough to make the point that it's not encouraged, much like when my kids were young enough to want to experiment with naughty words and I made them pay me a quarter in the jar. Eventually the jar was full, and it really didn't stop them from using those words.
We have gotten to the point where everyone is so careful not to offend...yet, are we at that point where offense isn't taken? Not even close. It seems that nowadays we are constantly observing the news where someone has said something that offends. In a PC world, we are still woefully making politically incorrect comments.
Is it the right to speech or the right to not be offended by speech that is more important?
In a country that says that we have the right to freedom of speech, tell that to a high school newspaper editor whose comments get him into hot water. Or a politician. Or any one of a number of people who say something without thinking.
Are words so precious that they sting like a missile? Yes - sure. We have seen it.
I think Kobe, personally, doesn't care. Give him a fine, give him a firing, he will still be playing basketball as NBAchris says.
But none of us are paying his salary to speak, are we? Those fans that support him only care about his game. A game that he gets paid a ridiculous amount of money to play, by the way.
Unless you yourself belong to a group that is often called a common racial/sexual slur, your perspective is kind of self-serving.
I remember the old expression my parents taught me when I was a kid:
"Sticks and stones will break my bones, but words will never hurt me."
I don't see uttering those words on the court as a fireable offense, no matter whether to the coach or the refs. It's trash talk that propels these testerone-fueled games. I don't condone it, and yet, how do you stop it? It's a game, which is a little like a mock war, if you come down to it.
I do think a simple fine would be enough to make the point that it's not encouraged, much like when my kids were young enough to want to experiment with naughty words and I made them pay me a quarter in the jar. Eventually the jar was full, and it really didn't stop them from using those words.
We have gotten to the point where everyone is so careful not to offend...yet, are we at that point where offense isn't taken? Not even close. It seems that nowadays we are constantly observing the news where someone has said something that offends. In a PC world, we are still woefully making politically incorrect comments.
Is it the right to speech or the right to not be offended by speech that is more important?
In a country that says that we have the right to freedom of speech, tell that to a high school newspaper editor whose comments get him into hot water. Or a politician. Or any one of a number of people who say something without thinking.
Are words so precious that they sting like a missile? Yes - sure. We have seen it.
I think Kobe, personally, doesn't care. Give him a fine, give him a firing, he will still be playing basketball as NBAchris says.
But none of us are paying his salary to speak, are we? Those fans that support him only care about his game. A game that he gets paid a ridiculous amount of money to play, by the way.
Overt assholiness, observed and documented, toward a league official should be punished by a stinging fine. I would suggest 10% of all revenues from "playing the game" for that year. The fine to be doubled at each iteration.
But male athletes that play popular sports are always given exceptional treatment. That, and the fact that if indeed the Lakers "fired" Kobe, the rest of the league would try to hire him in less than a nanosecond.
The line however should be drawn when comments are directed at Mom's. (generally, from comments from other males.) Comments about Dad's is borderline but not as bad.
I was at a tournament this weekend for my daughter. There were two refs. One called fairly - the other one, not so much.
A spectator in the stands made one comment - "watch the game!" and got booted from the stands and told to go to the parking lot. Then ref came over and lectured the parents, stopped the game to threaten our coach with a yellow card for disobedient fans and the coach said that his team was his responsibility, not the spectators.
I think this was an over the top response and in all my years of seeing the game, I have never seen a ref respond as such for such a minor comment. I do understand that it's hard being a ref. It's also hard being a parent when your kid is getting brutalized on the field (or in our case, the pool) to sit by and idly watch without comment.
I think it's hilarious that in youth sports we have such different rules than in spectator sports such as the NBA or NFL. In those venues, it seems encouraged to get rowdy to support your team.
Everything is fine until a player behaves badly or a spectator is beaten into a coma for no reason, except the team he supports.
Kobe is a pompous ahole, and slurs aren't cool, but I guarantee you that there is plenty said on the field and the court and elsewhere that never get caught by the cameras that is far, far worse. It's just the nature of the game. Sadly.
There is a time to grow up. Kobe is not a teenager. He is 33 yrs old. How many of us as parents would condone our 33 yo calling someone a slur at that age?
What I see is that for certain sports, certain behavior is deemed acceptable, and not for others.
Basketball players are notorious for being the bad boys, including cheating on wives. It is accepted. Tiger lost sponsors in the millions because in Golf he behaved like the BBall players. Nobody would have batted an eye lash of him having tons of GFs behind Elin's back if he was in Bball.
FB is in the middle. Some get away with the crap, some don't. It all depends on the league.
I can't tell you how many people I know that watch college BBall, but refuse to watch the NBA because of the behavior that is condoned in the league.
What bothers me the most is they do interviews of how they work with the community and want that respect, but when they get in trouble, the 1st word out of their mouth is don't make me your idol, I am human and never asked for that responsibility. BS, you sure as heck did when you do PSAs for Boys Club and United Way. You put yourself out there by selling an image.
Kobe sold an image.
This is my pet peeve. It is also why there are certain teams I will never respect or root for. Sorry Steelers you kept Ben. Sorry, Vikings you had that boat party. Sorry, Ravens you kept Lewis. Sorry, Pacers Ron Artest was disgraceful.
I give it up to BYU for suspending Brandon Davies. They risked a lot to suspend him. Davies understood the rules when he signed the docs.
We need the leagues to step up and prove to fans that when they sign a code of conduct it means something. It means there are penalties more than being suspended for a few games. Really, what is the true cost to them if they get suspended for a few games? It is water off a ducks back to them when they have multi-million dollar contracts, with multi-million dollar signing bonuses.
__________________
Raising a teenager is like nailing Jello to a tree
To the original Imus point? Imus is paid to TALK. What he says matters to whether he can keep his job. Kobe is paid to play basketball. What he does on the court matters to whether he can keep his job. Plus, I don't really think the kids think of the word "fag" as meaning gay, anymore. I think they think of it like the word "*******."
I am less bothered by what he said than by the fact that he has absolutely no respect for authority. In any other job, this kind of outburst at an official (cop, boss, etc) would generally result in firing. I don't understand why we give our athletes special privileges.
Now, as someone who was bullied because of my sexuality, I absolutely despise that word.
Kobe is being Kobe. Many hyper competitive male athletes, or men in dangerous or comptetive professions, use homosexual slurs to question the manliness of their opposition, or someone who does not seem to be making the grade in toughness, ability, etc. The homosexuals in the military deal may require some change of old attitudes and traditional slurs about "fags."
If Kobe can survive raping / rough consentual sex with a young woman in Colorado, then he will be unscathed by this. Hey, it probably gives him street cred to sell more shoes.
I am a big gay right supporter. But that word, at least to me, is now just a generic put down. I also am not easily offended by most remarks. I think Kobe is slime. Did I cover everything.
Don Imas lost his job for joking that a women's college basketball team looked like a bunch of nappy headed hoes. Kobe Bryant calls a ref a fag for giving him a technical. Should Kobe lose his job too?
