Political & Elections

Wood, I'm not surprised by anything anymore. My parents went out to Arizona this year and my dad wore a Wings shirt. Some old lady came up to him and said "Are you from Detroit or are you a Wings fan like everyone else around here?" Apparently, it's quite common to be a Wings fan in Arizona. I have no idea why.

We went to a game down in Columbus. I work with the Plymouth Whalers (OHL team) and two of the Columbus players are former Whalers. There were more Wings fans at this game than Columbus fans. It was so weird.

I have a few interesting Gordie Howe stories. He is an amazing guy. I first met him when I was like 7 and we had dinner with him at his former restaurant in Traverse City. Apparently, Probert had been in the restaurant a few hours before and threw a credit card at one of the waitresses. It was about 1 AM when we made it up to Traverse and Gordie Howe's Tavern was one of the only places open so we went in and Gordie and his wife were the only people in there. That's how we met them the first time. The next day we saw him at the mall and he asked us to walk around with him because he didn't want to be bothered. He and Colleen were super nice. We have a bunch of autographed jerseys and one of his books.

I also have a bunch of Ted Lindsay stuff autographed. His wife grew up in Hungary with my grandpa and she was a gypsy so they were always at my grandparents' parties. I have pictures of him with me when I was a baby, but I don't remember him. :(

Last story. I was in SoCal when Sergei Federov got traded to the Ducks. They were literally already talking about planning their victory parades and it was the headline everywhere.... How'd they do that season? I forgot

I love hockey lol. It was my second word and my dad gave me a hockey puck to sleep with in my crib. I wish I would have played at some point :/

I agree with him about the death penalty but he's still a moron.

Go Lions, indeed. They exceeded my expectations. (We've had a pool at work for the number opf games they'd win for this season and the past one).

Looking forward to the days of 9-7 again - lol.

because only conservative commentators are morons.

Tucker Carlson? The ultimate light-weight.

Gotta Love those Eagles and Michael Vick:

Just when it seemed like Michael Vick had earned a measure of forgiveness the host of a television news show has lashed out with perhaps the harshest words yet for the quarterback.

Tucker Carlson, a conservative political commentator for Fox, yesterday took umbrage that President Obama praised the Philadelphia Eagles for giving Vick a second chance, and then went over the top with this comment about Vick's dog-fighting crimes:

"I think, personally, he should have been executed for that."

Carlson's comments came as he was filling in for Sean Hannity on Hannity Tonight.

Trust me Donna, I think most Jets fans can forgive 'Ol Rex a few indiscretions with video cameras and his wife's toe-sies. A little creepy, a bit embarrassing. But we can forgive him for being stupid enough to let these videos hit the streets. It's a private matter.

I don't think us Giants fans will ever find it in our hearts to forgive the G-men for their display on the field this last Sunday in their choke-job against the Eagles, however! Talk about embarrassing!

The only thing I'm hoping for this season is that the Pats kick everybody's butts!

I don't really follow sports so all I know about sports is what I hear from sports experts.  What I have heard is that the New England Patriots are the best team in football.  I have also heard a lot that the Yankees suck. 

Bullet- it was Herm Edwards that scored.

Let me see if I can get this philosophy straight; unless it DIRECTLY effects me or I have DIRECT interests in what the actions of others does to me, it really isn't any of my business and I have no right to get upset about it. Sound about right?

You don't have to pretend I believe this. Though your obnoxious capitalization of the word "direct" might lead another to believe the opposite, I didn't even use a synonym of the word. And who said you have no "right" to get upset about it? Do whatever you want, but if you're advocating force on another when you don't even have an indirect involvement in the situation, it'll seem a bit silly. And if you were to act with the force you advocate, that'd be arbitrary. So far, your basis for involvement in Vick's life might as well be "I don't like him". Do you have anything better than that?

We've seen this act before, many times, from those we also placed on pedestals just because they could sing, or act, or throw a ball; and many times we've been disappointed again that they haven't learned their lesson or have been truly repentant.

Honestly, besides "he did it before", what reason do we have to think Michael Vick would ever be involved in dog fighting again? It's just an unreasonable suspicion on so many levels.

It will take time to earn our trust of him again.

You mean it will take time for everyone to forget the dog fighting pictures. There is no reason to think Michael Vick will enter dog-fighting again. It's just that people are repulsed by the acts (especially when there are pictures involved), and people are tend to think with their gut rather than their brains.


Unfortunately, too many are willing to quicly forgive because he has played at an MVP level this year. I wonder how many who so loudly praise his redemption now would be just as loud if he was having a terrible season, or still on the bench?

I was just as outspoken for him last as I am this year. I don't any reasonable people believe his on field performance has anything to do with his dog-fighting crimes. That's just silly.

Or in this case, it's only a dog or two (or a few dozen. Who cares really? They're just dogs, and not worth someone like me, right?).

Feel free to fabricate more of my beliefs if it makes you feel better. I said nothing remotely like this.

Perhaps you may want to reflect on the fact that this sentiment sounds scaringly similar to some of the arguments I've heard for many of the historical examples of the world's brutalities.

These "historical examples"... where are they in your post?

-- Edited by ImSoAnarchist on Sunday 19th of December 2010 07:36:49 PM

Nice sentiment, ImSoAnarchist. Let me see if I can get this philosophy straight; unless it DIRECTLY effects me or I have DIRECT interests in what the actions of others does to me, it really isn't any of my business and I have no right to get upset about it. Sound about right?

Or in this case, it's only a dog or two (or a few dozen. Who cares really? They're just dogs, and not worth someone like me, right?).

Perhaps you may want to reflect on the fact that this sentiment sounds scaringly similar to some of the arguments I've heard for many of the historical examples of the world's brutalities.

No. We ALL should care about the brutality so nonchalantly demonstrated by Mr. Vick, because he was placed in a special trust in America: entertain us, be good at it, and we will reward and idolize you. The lifestyle he chose, celebrating brutality and cruelty for his enjoyment and sense of manliness, are a stain on that idol worship. We should all rightfully ostracize him for his wanton cruelty, not because they were dogs, but because they were innocent and defenseless. THAT lifestyle, which tragically we know has become embedded in some of less than admirable parts of American culture, should rightfully be rebuked. To not do so would be to ignore our own humanity.

But as a dog owner, I will say that for someone to do something so cruel against an animal that, when given even the tiniest fraction of affection, repays it with a lifetime of unconditional devotion.... Well, that person is less than human in my book. Or at the least, his moral compass and value system is so ugly and distorted that he does not deserve to be associated with proper company, much less idolized for his ability to scramble out of the pocket.

Mr. Vick has demonstrated the first few steps in his quest for redemption and forgiveness for his acts of cruelty. We've seen this act before, many times, from those we also placed on pedestals just because they could sing, or act, or throw a ball; and many times we've been disappointed again that they haven't learned their lesson or have been truly repentant. Perhaps that is why we are hesitant to root for Mr. Vick now.

It will take time to earn our trust of him again. Unfortunately, too many are willing to quicly forgive because he has played at an MVP level this year. I wonder how many who so loudly praise his redemption now would be just as loud if he was having a terrible season, or still on the bench?

The dog that you're not selling, that has absolutely no remote relation to you? Or the shelter dogs in a different state, of a shelter you don't own, that you have no relation to?

Go *advocate* the infiltration of someone else's personal decisions.

There. Fixed.

^ How exactly are we "infiltrating" the decisions of someone's life? We're giving our opinions- something that we DO here on this forum.

^ I think he should just have to shovel dog waste for shelter dogs for his community service. Give those poor volunteers a break.

Growing up I was a Giant, Knick and Met fan. As I got older and realized what jerks some of the players were I started rooting for individual players.

Lifelong Patriots fan (wayyyyyy before Tom Brady) and Red Sox fan (agonized over the 1975 World Series).

I moved to PA in 1988 and began following the Eagles. When they threw Donovan McNabb out with the garbage; I had enough. I went out and bought Redskins gear! Ha! Nothing like cheering for a losing team. lol.

I still like the Phillies but have been to a few Nationals games and they are growing on me. I cannot ever forsee a time when I would ever cheer for the Yankees.

Vick has to prove he has changed. When the trust is broken, you just can't say move on, you need to prove yourself over and over again until it is repaired.

The Vick brothers have never been known to be angels.

Even with the dog issue removed, this guy gave the finger to the fans that were paying his salary back in 06 with Atlanta.

Little things tally up to be big things. I hope he has learned from life experience, but right now I am not willing to say he has.

I hate how the NFL has a "behave" yourself clause, but they rarely use it. Afterall, Ray Lewis is still playing.

And what will that do? Make you feel better? Quite selfish.


Nope. I think it's justice. Plus it will ensure that he never does it again. I'm not sure how it's selfish to punish someone for their crimes.

And what will that do? Make you feel better? Quite selfish.

Why do you want Vick to "burn"?

Last nights game proved he is back to his old self with that spiking the ball over the field goal.

Oh yes, the first sign a dog-fighter is back to old self is when he spikes the ball over the goal post.

Vick disgusts me, I am a dog owner who has a rescue. Sorry, but I don't buy what he is selling!

Is there anything Vick could do (within reasonable bounds) for you to view him more positively? If not, then I don't even see the point of your opinion.

Yankee fan always.

My favorite for sports is March Madness.

Bullet always puts my picks in his office pool, and MAN they get ticked to see me beating them on the charts. I always win in the early picks, but than lose when it comes to the sweet. My goal is to win that pool.

I went to college in Philly and have always had a distaste for them. Vick disgusts me, I am a dog owner who has a rescue. Sorry, but I don't buy what he is selling! Last nights game proved he is back to his old self with that spiking the ball over the field goal.

I don't like the Eagles or Ravens for the same issue. Hiring them is more about winning. These athletes also say I am human and not an idol. However when it comes to saving their arse they forget that the reason they can get top dollar defense is because they can play a sport.

If they cut them loose I respect them, if they hire them I see them in a negative light. Eagles are negative to me.